Path: mit-eddie!wuarchive!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!swrinde!cs.utexas.edu!mailrus!rutgers!netnews.upenn.edu!cps3xx!usenet From: usenet@cps3xx.UUCP (Usenet file owner) Newsgroups: alt.callahans Subject: Re: Boom Summary: *long* answer, notes taken from personal experience Keywords: Unrecoverable Main System Error Message-ID: <6189@cps3xx.UUCP> Date: 29 Jan 90 23:07:04 GMT References: <13376@phoenix.Princeton.EDU> Reply-To: frey@frith.UUCP (Zachary Frey) Organization: Michigan State University, College of Engineering Lines: 149 In article <13376@phoenix.Princeton.EDU> jwbirdsa@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (James Webster Birdsall) writes: > {I got LBJFed this afternoon.} > {Gotta make those bloody averages. Couldn't get away with just ONE >disaster this year, could I? No, of course not. Furthermore, I've >actually been sorta happy for a couple months here. It was high time for >the rug to take off from under my feet. > {And in many ways the LBJF is the absolute worst ending. 'Enemy' is a >nice, clear-cut, unambiguous role. I know how to deal with enemies. You >can hate your enemy; you can say, 'The problem is with them, not me.' >LBJF is much, much worse... > {And it leaves you with nobody to hate but yourself, because you >didn't make the grade.} > {If you are still listening, know this: I cannot hate you. You are >who you are; the problem is that I am not who I should be.} > {She said things just didn't click when we met. Which means I have >failed, for above all I am Chameleon, and it is my Function to MAKE >things click... > {It is my Function to pick up cues from people and be what they need >me to be. And I have failed. "NO!!" "Excuse me. I'm sorry for the outburst," says the young man in t-shirt and Levi's sitting in one of the many corners, "but you sound like you're about to make your life miserable in the same way that I managed to make my life miserable about two years ago." He stands. "You see, two years ago, I was LBJFed by my girlfriend. She said that she didn't really feel comfortable with the relationship anymore, and that she didn't want to be going out with anyone at this point in her life." A wry grin spreads across his face. "It gets worse, too. After this whole talk of how she just didn't want to be going out with anyone, within a week she is going out with someone else from my dorm floor. Within the same group of friends, even." "And I did just what you are saying. I swallowed it. IT WAS ALL MY FAULT. It seemed obvious that, if only *I* had been able to read her better, if only *I* had been a better communicator, that we would still be together. What could possibly be wrong with *me* (and I could come up with *lots* of things that were bad about myself) that had prevented it from working?" "'Oh, well,' I told myself, 'I was due for this kind of thing, anyway.' And I wondered if I really *deserved* a relationship." This time, a cheerier grin replaces the wry one as he walks up to the bar. "I think a dramatic pause is in order now. Mike, a shot of Glen Fiddich, neat, please." "The story gets a bit more upbeat from here, though. You see, I was very fortunate to have a friend in a strategic position. Mary and I had been friends for six years at that point. Not always close, but we'd still known each other for quite some time. And fairly well, too -- she was my second girlfriend ever back in high school. She was also my (now ex-)girlfriend's roommate." Chuckle. Sip. "It's kind of terrifying -- having an old girl- friend move in with your current one. Or to have two ex-girlfriends living together. You wonder what they talk about late at night. But that's another story ..." "The point is, Mary had a bit of an overall perspective on the situation. She was also being a bit more objective than I was. So, when I opened up to her, and sobbed on her shoulder for a while about how awful it was, and about how *I* must have done things wrong for things to work out this way ... Sip. Evil wicked grin at being able to throw in another dramatic pause. "... she read me the riot act. Pointed out to me that for relationships to work, and for communication to happen, it takes *TWO* people working at it, not just one. Told me that it doesn't matter if I was being perfect, if Karen didn't want to work at it, it was beyond my power. Also, she pointed out to me things that Karen had been doing, or had neglected to do, which were straining the relationship, and which did not count as honest communi- cation and good-faith relationship maintainence." "So I blew up at her. Told her that it didn't matter what Karen had done, I should have been able to handle it, should have been sufficient to deal wiht it. It was *my* fault, goddammit, and I was the 100% guilty one. I had this wonderful picture of reality built up, with my ultimate guilt and worthlessness at the center of it, and now she was assailing it with simple facts and common sense. How dare she!" "Mary most firmly told me that this was bullshit, that she didn't stay friends for six years with people who were as stupid and worthless as I was making myself out to be, and who said that Karen was that perfect anyway?" "I didn't quite accept this. I nursed my feelings of failure along for a while. Then, the impossible happened! Karen broke up with the Other Guy(tm), and we ended up getting back together." "It was utter disaster. After about a month, I got LJBFed again. It hurt even worse than before, for a number of reasons. All of the same old problems were still there, and all of the same old self-incriminations." Zach looks directly at James now, and starts speaking even more intensely than before. "But, it was different this time. Mary's advice was hitting home, when it hadn't before. You see, this time I realized that *it* *wasn't* *all* *MY* *fault*! Yes, there were things that I had done wrong, or that I hadn't seen, clues I hadn't picked up. BUT IT WASN'T MY RESPONIBLITY TO HAVE TO PICK UP CLUES. Karen had not fulfilled *her* responiblity to tell *me* what was bothering her, and had let it build up until there was nothing to do but break up. I had not been perfect. But *neither* *had* *she*." "This realization was what let me hang on to my self-respect. Yeah, it hurt like hell, too. But the difference was, I wasn't taking responsiblity for someone else's actions anymore. I am only responsible for what I do, and for the things that lie within my power. Other people are responsible for their actions." "You know, in a sense, by accepting that it was 100% my failing the first time, I was denying Karen her personhood. If it was all my fault, and if I could have made things work by getting everything right myself, then what does that leave for her? At that point, I just making her out to be a person-image that I can manipulate if I'm clever enough. And that's not a real realationship." "James, I don't know what the exact situation with you and your SO was. I am certain that you made mistakes. Every human does. But I am just as certain that she made mistakes also. Every human does. It's a simple truth, but so easy to forget in the middle of pain." "And whatever you do, DON'T ACCEPT FULL RESPONSIBILITY!!! That's a load of guilt that will turn your life into a private hell. Allow her to make mistakes and to be imperfect. Allow yourself that, too." He walks up to the chalk line. "Didn't know I was going to ramble on this long. James, I hope that you get something out of the story I've told tonight. Don't pull the same mistake I made. I heard a rumor once that humans have the ability to learn from the example of others." "To Responsilbity -- may we fully accept our own, and no one else's!" Siiip ... Toss <> He turns around and starts to walk back to his corner, then pauses and faces the room again. "Oh, yeah -- if you'd like to talk in private, feel free to email me. I don't promise immediate responses, but I do get back to people eventually." Papernet: Zachary Frey | frey@frith.egr.msu.edu | Usenet: the 514 Virginia St. | frey@msuegr.BITNET | Bellman's E. Lansing, MI 48823 | ...uunet!frith!frey | Paradise. Path: mit-eddie!rutgers!cs.utexas.edu!uunet!mcsun!ukc!icdoc!doc.ic.ac.uk!jp From: jp@doc.ic.ac.uk (John Precedo) Newsgroups: alt.callahans Subject: John replies to Peter Keywords: yak,yak,yak. I hope its helpful or interesting. Message-ID: <1501@gould.doc.ic.ac.uk> Date: 29 Jan 90 20:35:58 GMT Sender: jp@doc.ic.ac.uk Reply-To: jp@doc.ic.ac.uk (John Precedo) Distribution: alt Organization: Dept. of Computing, Imperial College, London, UK. Lines: 57 The man in the black jacket and studded belt walks in through the door, brushing some of the ever present snowflakes off his shoulders. "Why is it that it always seems to be snowing when somebody walks in here?" he asks. "Actually, there are gale force winds and some rain at my real-time location. Hmm, I must have passed through a snowy region on my path here." He removes his jacket (exposing another black T-shirt, this one a Bon Jovi tour shirt) and removes his leather gloves. As he looks around, his eyes light up and he waves to a "freelance idiot". "Hi there, Peter! I see the shards didn't damage you last time." >Sometimes I think I'm mad, sometimes the world. "Well, I know for a fact that the world is mad. As for you, I don't know. You don't sound it. *I*, on the other hand, am mad; but it's a different colour of crazy than the rest of the world." >I see things in the newspapers and on television (...) But I never do >anything about it, because I can never see the point. One person makes >no difference when they haven't the influence. "Yes, perhaps. But when lots of people do a little something, then there is a point. If everyone sat about and did nothing, then nothing would ever get done about injustices and suffering. Still, there are somethings that nobody could do anything about - natural disasters for example. Shake your fist at the sky, and it won't stop the hurricane." >I feel like a dual personality. There's me (...) and there's this other >part of me (...) continually whispering `Idiot. What's the point? What's >the point?' "Hope you don't mind me hacking about what you said, but those are the bits that I recognise. The little demon at the back of my skull is always giving me a running commentary on my stupidity. And even worse, at 2AM when I'm trying to get some sleep for a 6AM start, it'll be playing back my greatest mistakes. In slow motion. I just hope that the voice will get weaker and easier to ignore, 'cos I sure don't think it'll ever go away." >..and I'm slowly going mad. Anybody got any good ideas? "Well, you could always go completely, utterly, straight-jacket hugging, talking-to-little-green-men ga-ga. Get it over and done with ;-)" John winks at him, and chuckles. "But seriously folks, there's lots of things you could do when the fear/pain/ loneliness/insecurity/madness strikes. Sleep on it - you may feel better when you wake up. Read a good book - if you get caught up in the troubles of a fictional character, you can't worry about your own. Find a good friend, stock up on whatever you need to relax, and just talk about stuff. I doesn't matter what. Could be you problems, why life is a bitch, why life *isn'*t a bitch, art, music, the meaning of life......" The darkly attired operator pauses to reflect on what he's just said. "I know that they're not much; only temporary measures, they keep IT at bay rather than banish it for ever. Still, it's kept me going. So far" And with that he proceeds to look for soemone else to pass on a belated reply to.... (In another posting. There may be quite a few of these!) Path: mit-eddie!mintaka!yale!cs.utexas.edu!uwm.edu!rutgers!shelby!csli!cphoenix From: cphoenix@csli.Stanford.EDU (Chris Phoenix) Newsgroups: alt.callahans Subject: Re: Boom Keywords: Unrecoverable Main System Error Message-ID: <11995@csli.Stanford.EDU> Date: 30 Jan 90 00:33:36 GMT References: <13376@phoenix.Princeton.EDU> Sender: cphoenix@csli.Stanford.EDU (Chris Phoenix) Reply-To: cphoenix@csli.stanford.edu (Chris Phoenix) Organization: Center for the Study of Language and Information, Stanford U. Lines: 222 In article <13376@phoenix.Princeton.EDU> jwbirdsa@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (James Webster Birdsall) writes: > {It is my Function to pick up cues from people and be what they need >me to be. And I have failed. > {And out in the real world, forget it. I haven't a clue how to meet >people out there. Worse, none of my friends from earlier classes have >been able to solve the problem either. > {And consider: I'm such a social cripple that even in school, where >you're basically STUCK meeting new people whether you like it or not, I >still can't do it except via the computer. No, don't forget it. School is one-dimensional. Everyone acts exactly the same, and shuns everyone who doesn't. No wonder you couldn't meet people. In the real world, there's lots of different kinds of people. Some of the rule systems are much harder to learn than those of college. Some are easier. There's even rumors that a few people out there have no rule systems. And different things matter to different people Out There. So even if no one in college wants what you have to offer, someone Out There will. You just have to find them. If you're worried about finding a marriage partner, don't be. Do you know what the statistics are on the chances of a single woman over 30 ever marrying? Someone out there is at least as desparate as you are. (Note: I am not trying to characterize women, or even single women over 30, as desparate. Just saying that some of them are.) All you have to do is know where to look. I can't tell you that... but when you get out in the world, just befriend any single woman and ask her where you should go. > {She said things just didn't click when we met. Which means I have >failed, for above all I am Chameleon, and it is my Function to MAKE >things click. ... > {And it leaves you with nobody to hate but yourself, because you >didn't make the grade.} > {If you are still listening, know this: I cannot hate you. You are >who you are; the problem is that I am not who I should be.} You think romantic relationships are a matter of making things "click"? Wrong. Things can click just fine, she can be really attracted to you, you can have fun spending time together, and then BOOM! something you never suspected is breaking you up. And the attraction is still there, and everything seems perfect... but it's just not working. And there's no amount of changing on your part that will affect it. Being a chameleon is a help in a lot of social settings, but romance isn't one of them. Before we go any farther, listen to this: IT'S NOT YOUR FAULT! You don't believe me? I don't know any way to convince you. But just keep it in mind. Now, I know what you'll probably say next. If no amount of changing will help, why the hell did I give up my life to learn how to do it? I can't give you a good answer. But you aren't as far gone as you think. What you've described is a machine. But does a machine feel bad when it can't fulfill its function? No! Does a machine want to make people happy? No! Does a machine know that it has died? NO! > {And for all of you who are doubtless leaping forward to tell me to >relax and be myself, guess what? > {There isn't one.} I'm not going to tell you to be yourself. It's not that simple. But I am going to tell you to try to *find* yourself. You say you have a few rocks left. If you're still conscious of them, there's probably a lot more buried under all that shifting sand. Start with simple things. What do you like to do? Stop. Think of three things that the last time you did them, you had fun. Got them? Good. Machines don't have fun. Then go to morals. Is there anything that you think is *wrong*? Ted Bundy? Hitler? Sadism? Premarital sex? Cheating on your income tax? Good. Machines don't have morals. Once you know who you are, start acting like it. Ignore other people for a while, and do things that *you* like. > {I'm not even sure how long ago I died. It's been quite some time, I >think. The only part that seems to have independent existence is >Vampire, who is not suitable for general-purpose use. Spock is just a >big processor. Why isn't Vampire suitable for general-purpose use? Frankly, he sounds like the sanest of the lot. Spock is a mask. Berserker is an animal. Does Vampire have any personality? Is there anything wrong with it, or just different? Who posted that posting on extended-wear masks? The one that said whenever he had to take it off, he avoided looking in the mirror, and hadn't seen his real self in three years? That sounds like you. Just learn to look in the mirror more often. >There are so many things I just don't care about. So if >someone important to me wants me to be different, why shouldn't I >change if I can? > {And thus I come to be so mutable that there is no core left, just >the odd rock or two, irrational attitudes left over from many years ago. I know exactly what you're saying. When I came to Stanford, I was homophobic. Then one of my best friends told me she was bi. It took me 3 whole days to lose every bit of my homophobia. Frankly, your posting scares me, because I see a lot of myself in it. I just hope I stopped building my Spock in time, but I'm afraid that I built him years ago before I even got to high school. Maybe I just haven't realized yet how hollow I am. But I think there's still some of me left, some things that are part of me because *I* want them, not someone else. I think there's some of you left too. We could debate metaphysics for days. What makes a person more than an animal? What causes our likes and dislikes? Is it true that we're all machines, and you're just more explicit than most of us? But I won't. Just take it on faith for a while. Ditch Spock. If anyone can't deal with the rest of you, dump them. You need a break from changing yourself. > {What's worse is that I've just lost my last chance. From here on >out, the probabilities become negligible. I'm a senior, graduating >in early June. If you still think this, re-read what I said above. You've lost your last chance *until you graduate*. So have I, probably, and I'm here for another year! Maybe, when I get into the Real World and discover that it's no better than college, then I'll despair and wonder why I kept myself unmasked all this time if no one even cares that I am. But for now, I'm just waiting until I get away from these superficial people and have room to spread my wings. >After that, I have no idea where I'll be. There isn't >enough time to meet someone here and build up anything really meaningful >between now and then. Not anything meaningful enough for her to follow >me, or me to follow her. Here, you're just wrong. I know of two people who hardly knew each other. Then he became attracted to her. He had to leave at the end of the quarter. Within that one quarter, they had built enough that she left her studies and went with him. More on this in e-mail... > {For lo these many years I have labored to make myself as I am today. >To learn as much as I can. To process information accurately and without >distortion. To remember it when it is needed, and to make intelligent >correlations between apparently unrelated facts. > {And all for naught. There is nothing I can do for anybody that >somebody else can't do better. Again, you're just wrong. Yes, you've put in all this labor. And yes, some of it is useless. Spock, in particular, will have to be recompiled as soon as you leave college--or dumped entirely, which is what I advise. But just look at the math. There's 5 billion people on the planet. The probability that at least one of them is better than you at doing one of the things you do is enormous. But the probability that one of them is better than you at doing *all* the things you do well is miniscule. Say there's 100 things that you can do better than 80% of the population. Do you know what .2^100 is? So it is possible that there is still some position out there that you can fill better than anyone else. But that's not the point. The point is that you are *NOT* useless! >I can program rings around half the CS >majors here. But nobody wants to hire me. No one has wanted to hire you yet. Move to Silicon Valley. >Romantically, all I want to do >is make somebody happy. But nobody wants me. You haven't yet found someone who wants you. Believe me, they're out there. > {What am I MISSING? Where is the crucial element that I lack? I don't know what you're missing. I don't even know if you're missing anything, except yourself. And I already told you how to get that back. If you mean "Why have I failed at everything I tried", the answer is that you haven't. If you mean "Why do I have no purpose", the answer is that you just haven't found it yet. > {I have access to powerful computers. I have money. I have a car. I >have the instrumental power to do most anything I like except support >myself, and I have not the power to Touch another's life at all. If you mean "Why can't I Touch someone," the answer is that you should switch to AT&T. Sorry. The answer is that being a chameleon is not the right way to Touch someone. If I may paraphrase from a Source I've sometimes found useful: "If I speak the languages of men, and of angels, but I don't have love, I'm like cymbals clanging." You're just trying too hard. You're trying to Touch someone by being totally mutable, and doing everything they want. This is a good way to make "friends". It's not a good way to have a relationship. Your girlfriend doesn't want to see herself every time she looks at you. She wants to see you, and see that you love her. There's nothing of you to see at the moment. Remember that this can change, if you try. > {Maybe I should just go with the self-destruct sequence and let >somebody else use the resources I'm currently consuming. As it stands, >I'm a useless object and easy enough to replace. Or maybe I should just >patch myself into the computer and stay here, the resident phantom of >Callahan's.} You are not useless. You have incredible potential there. You may be easy to replace where you are, but that doesn't mean anything. A baby is easy to replace, in exactly the same sense you mean. But a baby is one of the most precious things there is. Just a random example. From what I hear, some forms of mental disorder involve an internal world with shifting settings but consistent logic. Sounds like working with these people would be right up your alley. > {Which one of you will speak the words that reorder the world to my >liking, I ask, and there is naught but silence because you and I are >both but human. > {And that's about all there is to say about that.} You can try to reorder the world to your liking. People who try to do that are never satisfied with the world they have. They might even construct a world for themselves. We learned in HS psych that this is a psychotic. You can try to reorder yourself to the world's liking. This is what you tried to do. People who try to do that fade and may eventually disappear. At least you've realized it in time to save yourself. The fact that you're so upset tells me that you're not beyond hope. I won't speak any such words. I will tell you how to get along in the world, maybe even have a little fun, maybe even fulfill your Purpose (which is a lot different from a Function, BTW). But don't just listen to me. Go out and find out how to live rather than process. It's not easy, and I'm still struggling with it myself, but I believe it's possible. I have to believe it's possible, because otherwise I'm in as hopeless a position as you are. Please don't prove me wrong. -- Chris Phoenix | A harp is a nude piano. cphoenix@csli.Stanford.EDU | "More input! More input!" ...And I only kiss your shadow, I cannot see your hand, you're a stranger now unto me, lost in the dangling conversation, and the superficial sighs... Path: mit-eddie!mintaka!yale!cs.utexas.edu!uwm.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!mips!apple!ames!decwrl!ucbvax!mtxinu!unisoft!greywolf From: greywolf@unisoft.UUCP (The Grey Wolf) Newsgroups: alt.callahans Subject: Re: Speaking in Tongues, Helping A Friend Message-ID: <2783@unisoft.UUCP> Date: 30 Jan 90 01:37:40 GMT References: <9001231655.AA03174@fsdcupt.csd.mot.COM> Reply-To: greywolf@unisoft.UUCP (The Grey Wolf) Lines: 73 This may post articles to many machines. Are you absolutely sure you want to do this? [yn] yewbetcherass! In article jefyoung@pawl.rpi.edu (Jeffrey Young) writes: > >Greywolf enters, looking pretty bad. I listen quietly to his >dilemma, and as he finishes, I get him some of that Midori stuff >he likes. Plopping himself into the seat next to the >elfin empath, he passes the mug to him. "Better drink it.. >'cause otherwise It'll go to waste. I don't drink alcoholic >beverages, if that's what it is." He gives the Elf a hug. { That's just what it is; it's a liqueur made from honeydew melon. You should try it sometime. It's rather pleasant. Thank you. } The half-elf takes a sip of the Midori offered him...it seems to have quite a warming effect. >"That feeling of dread, that something bad is going to happen? >I hate when that happens. The only thing worse is feeling >depressed for no reason at all. That's a pain.. well, >you've come back to where people do care, and we've been >patiently awaiting your return, though not in this state. >C'mon.. she's your soulmate, man, and you should wait for her! { Well... }, he starts, his sending is getting kind of fuzzy... { I don't know what's going on, even still. But I'm not feeling down at this point... I'm feeling kinda weird, but then company morale gets kind of weird around here from time to time... I'm watching my someday-in-the-future-wife fall physically apart from worrying, from not being where she wants to be, and she feels powerless to do much about it. I finally told her last night (got to see her again -- she relaxes and becomes so much less stressed out when she is with me) that she really needs to exit her situation soon, or else she's going to fall apart. } >I'm STILL waiting to meet mine..so count your blessings and >be prepared for the worst, since something has seen fit to >warn you. But don't wait for it to happen.. that's no good.. >be alert and aware, and perhaps you can alleviate the >dilemma before it turns into a disaster..a watched pot >never boils." { Things have, however, improved over here. I think the weird feeling had nothing whatsoever to do with my soulmate. It had to do with something else, to which I have no clue. It was something I could not word, evidently, for were I able to word it, I would have known what it was about. } > > -Taldin The Blue Unicorn > Defender Of Light > >-- >"You are blue, Unicorn.. the Blue of clear, cloudless days where >everything seems like it's going right and nothing could go wrong.. >and the Blue of despair and lonliness." > jefyoung@pawl.rpi.edu { Thanks for all who responded to my posting. Hope I'm not wearing my welcome out (my initial instinct when something is wrong is to go away so that I don't wear down my friends). Yeah, I know, "What are friends *for*?" Well, a lesson once learned is so hard to forget, whether or not it's from a true friend. } He sips his Midori quietly, and sends part of his song -- not by him, but very relevant to him... "Did her eyes, at the Turn of the Century/Tell me plainly/How we'll meet, How we'll love? Oh let life/So transform me/Like leaves we touched, we danced; we once/Knew the story/As Autumn called, and we both remembered/ All those many years/Ago/I'm sure we know..." -- "You guys are NUTS! En-Vee-Tee-Ess, NUTS!" -- History of the World, part I. Newsgroups: alt.callahans Path: mit-eddie!mcmullan From: mcmullan@eddie.mit.edu (Greg McMullan) Subject: Re: Boom Message-ID: <1990Jan30.045958.24954@eddie.mit.edu> Reply-To: mcmullan@eddie.MIT.EDU (Greg McMullan) Organization: organized? Me?! Hah! References: <13376@phoenix.Princeton.EDU> <11995@csli.Stanford.EDU> Date: Tue, 30 Jan 90 04:59:58 GMT Lines: 96 Chris Phoenix is giving good advice to James Webster Birdsall, and says (in part): >I can't give you a good answer. But you aren't as far gone as you think. >What you've described is a machine. But does a machine feel bad when it >can't fulfill its function? No! Does a machine want to make people happy? >No! Does a machine know that it has died? NO! > This struck a chord for me, and actually prompted me to post a bit of poetry that I found a while back and which I really like. It seems appropriate here, and I hope that it helps some. (One of these days, I will get my act together and actually post an introduction of myself, but that will take more time than I have at the moment.) Hymn Of Breaking Strain Rudyard Kipling The careful text books measure (Let all who build beware!) The load, the shock, the pressure Material can bear. So, when the buckled girder Lets down the grinding span, The blame of loss, or murder, Is laid upon the man. Not on the Stuff---the Man! But in our daily dealing With stone and steel, we find The Gods have no such feeling Of justice toward mankind. To no set gauge they make us,--- For no laid course prepare--- And presently o'ertake us With loads we cannot bear. Too merciless to bear. The prudent text-books give it In tables at the end--- The stress that shears a rivet Or makes a tie-bar bend--- What traffic wrecks macadam--- What concrete should endure--- But we, poor Sons of Adam, Have no such literature, To warn us or make sure! We hold all Earth to plunder--- All Time and Space as well--- Too wonder-stale to wonder At each new miracle; Till, in mid-illusion Of Godhead 'neath our hand, Falls multiple confusion On all we did or planned. The mighty works we planned. We only of Creation (Oh, luckier bridge and rail!) Abide the twin-damnation--- To fail and know we fail. Yet we---by which sole token We know we once were Gods--- Take shame in being broken However great the odds--- The Burden or the Odds. Oh, veiled and secret Power Whose paths we seek in vain, Be with us in our hour Of overthrow and pain; That we---by which sure token We know thy ways are true--- Inspite of being broken, Because of being broken, May rise and build anew. Stand up and build anew! Mike - a glass of white wine, please. I guess a toast is appropriate. To standing up and building anew! Greg McMullan keeper of the alt.callahans archives on eddie.mit.edu mcmullan@eddie.mit.edu Path: mit-eddie!rutgers!tut.cis.ohio-state.edu!pt.cs.cmu.edu!andrew.cmu.edu!jf2z+ From: jf2z+@andrew.cmu.edu (John Charles Fiala) Newsgroups: alt.callahans Subject: Look what the cardboard cat dragged in... Message-ID: Date: 30 Jan 90 06:24:57 GMT Organization: Class of '92, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA Lines: 25 He stopped, purring. His pet hadn't looked at this part of the net, and what was this? He swivelled his neck, checking the spelling, just in case... it DID match! He smiled, imagining his pet's pleasure at seeing THIS pop up out of nowhere... WAIT! That's him, now, returning from classes... quickbackontheshelfbackintoposefadeintotwodimentions... I wandered over to my Mac, wondering why my roommate keeps leaving it on. I hit ^G, then stare. Callahans??? I swivel my neck, to check the name on the third copy of the Book that I have owned (keep givin' the suckers away), and the spelling matches. I read, and marvel. I square my shoulders, and walk into a place both strange and familiar... My eyes boggle at the size of the Place, and walking by the bar, order a diet Coke before turning to meet friends new, and old. He fills himself out to the third dimention, and allows himself a satisfying stretch as he sees his pet pay more attention to the screen than to the "Flatcat" he had bought for himself on his birthday. Someday, he will reveal himself to his pet, but until then, he remains.. ------ George QuickPaw Professional Cat (Rates negotiable) You can reach me through my pet, John Fiala, at: jf2z@andrew.cmu.edu ------ Path: mit-eddie!snorkelwacker!bionet!uwm.edu!srcsip!nic.MR.NET!thor.acc.stolaf.edu!agnes.acc.stolaf.edu!seebs From: seebs@agnes.acc.stolaf.edu (The Laughing Prophet) Newsgroups: alt.callahans Subject: Just thought I'd say hi... Message-ID: <11074@thor.acc.stolaf.edu> Date: 30 Jan 90 07:01:30 GMT Sender: news@thor.acc.stolaf.edu Reply-To: seebs@agnes.acc.stolaf.edu (The Laughing Prophet) Distribution: alt Organization: Followers of the Jigging Cat Lines: 24 (I subscribed to this newsgroup right away, but I hadn't seen articles showing up until now... I just thought I'd drop in and say hi...) SeebS walks in the door, rather casually. He props his walking stick in a corner, and walks up to the bar. To avoid being carded, he just asks for a cold root beer. He then strolls over to a random table, not bothering to see if there's anyone there. He doffs his hat, then dons it again, then, just to be different, dxors it. He looks around, as if expecting something to happen. There is a pause. There is another pause, seperated from the first by a slightly shorter pause. Nothing happens. SeebS sips his root beer, calmly accepting the frenzied passivity around him. "Anything up? I'm sort of new to this conversation..." --SeebS-- "Fare you well, fare you well, I love you more than words can tell." Path: mit-eddie!bloom-beacon!shelby!neon!lucid.com!lucidboston!kdo From: kdo@lucid.com (Ken Olum) Newsgroups: alt.callahans Subject: Re: Roller Coaster from HELL! Message-ID: <158@boston-harbor.lucid.com> Date: 30 Jan 90 16:21:01 GMT References: <358@88opensi.UUCP> Reply-To: kdo@lucid.com Organization: Lucid East, Sharon MA Lines: 44 In article <358@88opensi.UUCP> ed@88opensi.UUCP (Ed Anderson) writes: > >Sorry for being such a downer tonight...... Don't apologize. After all, what else is Callahan's for? >I would like your feedback, how do I start to let people back in my >life? And how do I do it and retain some level of protection/security >on myself? Sooner or later you'll have to face your feelings and all the bad things that happened to you. When bad things happen you have to go on living and so you have to hide them away and not think about your memories too much when you have to deal with the world. This works in the short run but it loses big in the long run. You can't just hide this stuff. Sooner or later you have to stare it straight in the eye and say "Yes, this happened to me, and yes it was a terrible, awful thing." And you have to feel all the grief and upset and cry about it and all that stuff. But then it will get better and easier to face and you'll be able to go out with your friends and not be afraid that old upsets will come through when you don't want them to. >"I don't know if the commaraderie will bring on memories that may >break me." > You do have to deal with these memories, but you can do it when you choose and are free to cry about them, AND THEY WON'T BREAK YOU. The best thing is to get with close friends or family who will support you while you deal with this stuff, and this may put you in a catch-22 if you are avoiding close friendships. So, use Callahan's. That's what it's here for, right? If you type in how you feel, even in the depths of despair, you'll get nothing but support. No one will criticize you for being down, or being upset, or showing your feelings, or anything like that, because this isn't a cocktail party -- this is Callahan's Place. We make sure here that when you want to say your piece that other folks listen and are supportive and don't criticize and don't give you advice unless you ask for it. Right, Eddie? "Right!" Ken Path: mit-eddie!mintaka!yale!cs.utexas.edu!rice!husc6!bbn!granite!mwolf From: mwolf@granite.cr.bull.com (Mary-Anne Wolf) Newsgroups: alt.callahans Subject: Re: Boom Keywords: reboot new system (was Unrecoverable Main System Error) Message-ID: <1990Jan30.172136.13712@granite.cr.bull.com> Date: 30 Jan 90 17:21:36 GMT References: <13376@phoenix.Princeton.EDU> <11995@csli.Stanford.EDU> Reply-To: mwolf@granite.cr.bull.com (Mary-Anne Wolf) Organization: Bull HN Information Systems Inc. Lines: 47 A voice comes from the vicinity of the ceiling. "It is harder to meet people after you graduate from school. More of them are married (or an equivalent), and it is sometimes hard to find out who is available because no-one wants to look desparate. Some who are unattached have good reasons WHY they are. I'm fat and diets have not worked for me, and very few American men would consider dating a fat woman -- sad, but true. A friend who is a nice person, and very interesting company, completely lacks sex-appeal. I wish I COULD fall in love with him, he'd be fun, but I can't get excited about him. So there is no shortage of people you wouldn't want. As I said, it is harder, but it is not impossible. I know people who have met SOs through their jobs, at conferences, in courses they have taken for fun, at religious retreats, through their room-mates, using personal ads, using introduction services, while folk-dancing, and at parties. A group of undergrads at Yale used to get together once a week in the evening and read children's stories to one another, as a way of relaxing. People brought "cookies and milk" or logical extensions of that, so the listeners munched while they listen. Multiple sets of Yale alumni have continued this practice since graduating. It has proven a very effective way to meet SOs, although I have not, maybe because there's less pressure than the usual bar or party. I guess the thing about meeting SOs is that just doing your job and spending the evening alone greatly lowers your chances. If you make the effort to get out of the house and do things which would be fun even if no meeting resulted, then it is likely to help. I am still single, so there's something I still need to learn about making this work, but at least I have been able to meet members of the opposite sex who are not spoken-for. They are out there." Mary-Anne mwolf@pws.bull.com or mwolf@granite.cr.bull.com "It is so clear, you were meant to be here...from the beginning." -- Path: mit-eddie!snorkelwacker!usc!wuarchive!cs.utexas.edu!rice!uw-beaver!milton!blake!unicorn!n8442349 From: n8442349@unicorn.WWU.EDU (joy ralph m) Newsgroups: alt.callahans Subject: Just passing through, alas. Message-ID: <457@unicorn.WWU.EDU> Date: 30 Jan 90 17:44:03 GMT References: <13376@phoenix.Princeton.EDU> <11995@csli.Stanford.EDU> <1990Jan30.045958.24954@eddie.mit.edu> Reply-To: n8442349@unicorn.WWU.EDU (joy ralph m) Organization: Western Washington Univ, Bellingham, WA Lines: 15 The door bangs open, and the small centaur is back, although somewhat breathless. Today she has a backpack over one shoulder, and an arm full of journals. "I just wanted to stop in and thank everyone who sent me e-mail or replied to my story the other, uh" she pauses, thinks, and a look of consternation passes over her face, "week, I believe. Things are still progressing, but the upshot of it all is that I'm not going to run/ruin my life for someone else, especially if they have to hide behind an 'elderly and conservative clientel.' Thank you all for the support which has given me some courage to do things the way _I_ want to, for once." She flashes a grin, and dashes back out, calling over her shoulder "I'll be back for a drink after I'm done with these silly papers!"